Chemical Applicator and 50' of 3/8" hose?

[Roof Cleaning Cleveland]

Looks good Jeff. 

[Jeff]

Thanks Tom,..I'm gonna work on a nicer looking setup over the Winter months.  Been wanting to try a portable,..I think these do have several uses,..Be a good middle ground applicator,..where the pump up's are sometimes too small,..but the roof rig is overkill,...this should fill that gap. 

This is my first go round with 12V so I need to catch up on all you veteran 12 volters. Gonna order the one Chris recommended and use it as a second/,backup unit. Just want to get my feet wet with this one.

Jeff

Edited September 3, 2015 by Jeff

[PeakOfPerfection]

Anybody check the compatibility of the battery acid with the ingredients? Pumps...leak. You get SH and battery acid or fumes mixed and you get BOOM. 

Edited September 3, 2015 by PeakOfPerfection

[Jeff]

Yea, maybe I'll put the battery in it's own box.   Aren't lawn and garden batteries sealed though?   I guess they could still leak,..but they don't have the caps like the old ones did,..at least this one doesn't.  But I will still divide them better and also put a few more holes in the bucket for ventilation. maybe I'll enclose the pump,..it's not gonna see alot of use anyhow to get hot,..maybe even a plastic tray on top of the battery to catch any leaks that happen before i catch them.

The fumes from Purple Power aren't flammable on their own and neither is bleach.  

Jeff

Edited September 3, 2015 by Jeff

[Pro Clean Exteriors]

Jeff,

Just ran across this, looking for something else, that might work for you if you're tight on space. Says it shoots 25'.

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200641907_200641907?isSearch=47195

When you spray on Purple Power for gutters are you diluting and how much? 

Thanks

[Apple Roof Cleaning (813) 655-8777]

 

Chris,..Question for you,.....I was experimenting with the flow rate to tone down the flow and the pressure,....Turning the pressure switch down just causes cycling,..but to have it up causes too much flow,..along with the PSI.    So,..what I did was make the pickup line very small,..went from 3/8" to 1/4" first,..still too much,...then I went to a size smaller than 1/4" not sure the exact size, just had it laying around,..it makes the flow and pressure perfect for what I want.  By restricting the intake it restricts the PSI and the flow.  And the motor doesn't sound like it's working as hard with the smaller hose,..so my question is,...is this restriction on the intake in any way gonna hurt anything?  I figured as long as it's pumping liquid it's ok,..and with the pump not working as hard,..I can't see what it's gonna hurt,..BUT,..that is why I'm asking.   I can switch intake hoses easy enough for times I may want more flow and PSI.

I like the bucket because with the lid it is now waterproof,..this pump is used sparingly for short spray times so heat won't be an issue,..probably around a total of 10-15 minutes per job,..  May go to the original idea of a hand truck,.but I am OUT of room,Ha,Ha,..

*Gonna use a prettier bucket next time,..this was just a prototype.  

**Pump is mounted to an oak board and lays between the battery terminals. Gonna insulate the posts and also run charging posts to the outside of the bucket.

***May try to cut down a hand truck to the size of two buckets stacked,..with something on there to keep the hose on. And also add bigger tires so it will roll easier. Not sure I even have room for that.

Jeff

 

 

 

Jeff, in a perfect world, it is never the very best idea to control flow by starving a pump, but I have done it many many times, and as long as you don't suck a feed hose shut, or suck a diaphragm, you will be ok. 

In fact, it is a far better plan IMHO, then to use an accumulator, or to allow the pumps motor to cycle on and off.  I used to simply take a pinch valve over the intake feed hose like this 

[Roof Cleaning Jacksonville FL 904-304-0810]

I have a 2gpm 70 psi pump I use for applying chems on decks and other stuff as needed. I have 3/8" goodyear ag hose on a dolly with a tractor battery. I use mine for caustic, acid, bleach, etc. So far getting at least a year or more out of each one. My last one was a delavan. This time I bought the one from northern tool and it's just as good as the others. The nice thing is, you get a pump, some hose, a battery and a wand and you're set. It doesn't have to be super complicated at all.

[Jeff]

 Thanks Chris,..the inlet hose isn't collapsing at all. So I'm gonna go with it. 

  I like that pinch valve,..use one hose and adjust as needed. Yea, I realize starving a pump isn't good,..but I'm with you on the perfect World thing. I think it's better than an accumulator as well, and doesn't take up any space or have bladder failure.

I use Purple Power diluted by 50/50 with water during the warm humid Summer months,..early Spring and Fall I use it more on the straight side.. 

Yes, I like the idea of the 12V portable so far,.and it is a simple system. Good to hear the longevity of your pump spraying various chemicals. The dolly idea is a good one,..I'm just out of room.

*On the possibility of a leaking pump,..I think I'm gonna take a bucket and cut the bottom off so I have a drip pan  about 3"  Then I will mount the pump to this on the inside and put it inside the bucket and rest it on a ledge I will screw to the side made form rubber blocks or even wood.  Will  also hide the battery and make a cleaner look. There will be charging posts to the outside of the bucket.

Jeff

Edited September 4, 2015 by Jeff

[Apple Roof Cleaning (813) 655-8777]

LOL, I have suggested that many  RCIA Members replace leaky troublesome accumulators  with simple (and cheap) pinch valves. I have no idea how many took me up on my advice ? 

These numbered pinch valves are really cool, because their settings are repeatable.  A 12 volt pump can cycle on and off rapidly, depending on your nozzle size. So, what you do is use  XYZ nozzle, and simply restrict the flow using the pinch valve, until the cycling stops. Then, simply record the setting number of the pinch valve that you use with XYZ Nozzle.  

Of course, different 12 volt pumps will be able to "adjust" to being "starved" at the intake differently.  

LOL again Jeff, but you could even take a tank full of pure SH on your trailer or truck, hook a 12 volt pump to it with one of these valves on BOTH the input and output hoses, and presto, you now have a chemical delivery (injection) system. 

 

 

 

Edited September 4, 2015 by Apple Roof Cleaning (813) 655-8777

[Jeff]

Yea Chris,..I actually remember you discussing these things in the past,..but I had no interest because I wasn't using 12V for anything,..but I would have listened. The only reason I could see using an accumulator over these would be the flexibility of being able to run both high flow and low flow with the simple change of a nozzle. Where as,.. the smaller suction line restricts flow and pressure, resulting in lost distance and coverage rate when it's needed,..requiring the opening of the pinch valve or changing the suction hose size to a larger diameter,..back at the pump.

But yes,.in my case,..I will be using this thing with lower flow and PSI 90% of the time,..so the pinch valve would be ideal for me.

Jeff

 

[Apple Roof Cleaning (813) 655-8777]

Yea Chris,..I actually remember you discussing these things in the past,..but I had no interest because I wasn't using 12V for anything,..but I would have listened. The only reason I could see using an accumulator over these would be the flexibility of being able to run both high flow and low flow with the simple change of a nozzle. Where as,.. the smaller suction line restricts flow and pressure, resulting in lost distance and coverage rate when it's needed,..requiring the opening of the pinch valve or changing the suction hose size to a larger diameter,..back at the pump.

But yes,.in my case,..I will be using this thing with lower flow and PSI 90% of the time,..so the pinch valve would be ideal for me.

Jeff

 

Yes, either way has advantages and disadvantages. Experience has taught me to keep stuff as simple as possible, especially with the SH. The more connections you have, the more chances for leaks. The accumulator requires 2 connections, and a rubber bladder. 2 more chances for a leak   

 

[Roof Cleaning Cleveland]

  Finally got a picture.  I need to get a gun, but I'll be trying it out tomorrow.

[Jeff]

Is that a cordless drill battery pack?  If it holds up that is a good idea.  I am gonna try wheelchair batteries next season, but will also be interested in hearing from you about these batteries. 

Nice and compact idea all the way around. I guess you have the wires really enclosed and protected under the lid.

* I actually went with the hand truck idea,..I will get pictures up before long. Really liking it,..and am planning on making another one. 

 

Jeff

[Roof Cleaning Cleveland]

I used it today to clean a small deck.  The batteries should be fine.  I have a weed whacker that runs on these batteries, did my whole yard with half a charge(I don't have a big yard).  Actually, I normally use the lithium ion version of that battery.  Worked really nice, and the small hoses made cleanup easy.

[Jeff]

Here is a sprayer cart I've been working on. The pump and the battery are in the bucket. The solution bucket sets on top of this bucket,..Both held in place by plastic yellow chains. 

I also wanted to share how a $20.00 air hose reel can be converted into an application reel with a chemical proof core. The weakest link in the reel is the steel pieces that create the swivel,..but,..these pieces are easily replaced as you can see. And could also be made from stainless,.(I had galvanized on hand). *The brass ends of the hose will also need upgraded at some point,..
 

The hose reel is on sale at Tractor Supply,..but even regular cost is only $25.00,..keep it painted and it will last a LONG time. The swivel and spring needs to be removed,..and adapted to fit the new "swivel",..The adapter for this comes with the reel,..it is on the inlet side (1/2" M X 1/4" F)

Although the spring holds the reel itself on the frame of the reel,...this is easily accomplished with simple zip ties over the frame,..keeps the reel from sliding off,..and seems to be holding with no issues yet,..and I think it will be fine. You can see the zip ties in the second picture if you tilt your screen just right,Ha,Ha,..

This is my "prototype",..although the final version won't change much,...maybe a prettier bucket for the pump and battery.

*Also gonna be trying a wheelchair battery,..they are 12AH and only 8 LBS. The Delavan 7812 only pulls about 6 amps max,...so I think this battery will be ok for my uses.
**I've been using quick couplers as a swivel on my roof cleaning hose reel for about 10 years now,..so this idea works really well,..and doesn't wear o-rings like you'd think,..in fact about one maintenance change a season is about it.

***The hose is 3/8" Kuri-Tec Tundra air hose,..din't like it at first,..but it is really nice after all,..does NOT kink at all. Has a weird property about it,..feels more like a heavy piece of rope.
 

Edited October 9, 2015 by Jeff

[PeakOfPerfection]

If you plan on spraying SH, I still want to emphasize that putting a battery in with the pump is maybe something to re-think. SH is highly highly basic, and battery acid is highly acidic. The two do not go together well and if they do happen to get together, the result is a bomb in a bucket. Even gel cell batteries are highly acidic...they just add silica to the sulphuric acid to make it thicker. When you are drawing a lot of amperage, the battery tends to output fumes from the chemical reaction and if you get a little drip leak in your pump connection...

Batteries also tend to create hydrogen gas. Hydrogen plus a spark equals boom.

Only a battery that has been converted to an Alum (aka alkaline salt) battery won't react in terms of an acid/base...though it makes hydrogen gas. 

And a wheelchair battery is a great idea. Deep cycle is what those electric pumps really want if you run them for any length of time. Just make sure your charger has a deep cycle setting on it or you can charge the battery too rapidly and it will lose capacity. 

 

Edited October 10, 2015 by PeakOfPerfection

[Jeff]

Thanks for the advice Kevin,..yes,..the final version will have the two separate,...Right now,.there is a drip pan under the motor for any potential leaks,..and the bucket has a few 1" holes drilled into it to allow any wandering gasses to vent.  

*It's funny,...just so happens I was a TSC yesterday,..and they have these new black plastic ammo boxes in stock,..never seen them till' yesterday,..they're kinda like the military style,..they come in two sizes big and small,..$10-$15,...the small one looks just right for the wheelchair battery. May mount it on the lower backside of the cart.

Jeff

Edited October 10, 2015 by Jeff

[Jeff]

Some improvements made. Battery and pump now separated. Wheelchair battery in top box, pump in the bottom. Not a completed design yet,.but getting there,..and am having fun in the process. Both ventilated,..pump is only run for a few minutes at a time at most,..  so over heating shouldn't be an issue anyhow. 10 Gauge wire connecting,..pump draws only 6 AMPS max,..so soldered connections and heat shrink tubing should be adequate connections.

Jeff

 

Edited October 12, 2015 by Jeff