Improving The Fat Boy Roof Cleaning Pump !

65 posts in this topic

Posted

Both the Delavan Fat Boy, and the Flo Jet Pentaflex are awesome roof cleaning pumps.

As long as you have a shingle roof with gutters, to catch the run off! 

On a Tile Roof, the output from the pump is so much, that run off is a serious problem.

 

Now, if you use a smaller nozzle with the Fat Boy or Pentaflex, the pump cycles on and off too much, and will burn itself up!

Some have tried additional bladders with the pumps to help this, but w/o a lot of success.

So, I got to thinking, the Fat Boy is a 12 volt pump, right ?

So, why not slow the god dam pump down, by simply using a  Rheostat to reduce the voltage it sees?

Now, we will need a 20 amp 12 volt Rheostat, and I have not tried this, so I don't know for sure it will work. 

 

But IF we can pull this off, it will be a great advancement in roof cleaning pump technology I think ?

 

 

Here is something that may work even better then a Rheostat http://www.cloudelectric.com/product-p/co-kdz24200.htm

 

It is a 12 volt 150 amp capable adjustable power supply using Pulse Width Modulation. 

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Posted

Not real certain, but I think reduced voltage will also destroy the armature and cause it to fail???   Hello electrical experts.

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Posted

Not real certain, but I think reduced voltage will also destroy the armature and cause it to fail???   Hello electrical experts.

It's been a few years since high school but IIRC, it's the amps that create the heat.

 

It's a fixed circuit with fixed resistance (pump motor), all you can change is the voltage. Since they are all tied to Ohm's law, lowering the voltage with a fixed resistance has to increase the current (amps).

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Posted

Im no expert when it comes to 12 volts, but I do use the accumulator tank and it allows me to nozzel down quite a bit. The Fatboy will pump on the mix when I ask it to and the run off is a problem. Chris you are the guru and I will try anything that will help, but the accumulator does help.

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Posted

Im no expert when it comes to 12 volts, but I do use the accumulator tank and it allows me to nozzel down quite a bit. The Fatboy will pump on the mix when I ask it to and the run off is a problem. Chris you are the guru and I will try anything that will help, but the accumulator does help.

 

 

 

 

Most of these accumilators are made out of EDPM insides, and I have concerns they may leak from the inside under hard use. Plus, they also require an additional connection between your pump and hose reel, another leak source, possibly.

It MAY work better to just slow the pump down, we shall see!

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Posted

I dont know how long the accumulator is suppose to last. But I broke all my equipment down this winter and I have installed a new accumulator as well as all new fittings and clamps.

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Posted

I dont know how long the accumulator is suppose to last. But I broke all my equipment down this winter and I have installed a new accumulator as well as all new fittings and clamps.

That was a good idea! The accumilator has an EDPM Bladder inside it, and the Chlorine can and will attack it, 

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Posted

I use the accumulator with the 5850 pumps.  Seems to work out ok.  Was wondering if using 2 accumulators would work better and how would you hook them up?

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Posted

I use the accumulator with the 5850 pumps.  Seems to work out ok.  Was wondering if using 2 accumulators would work better and how would you hook them up?

That's a very good question! 

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Posted

That's a very good question! 

This would be a good question for Bob at pressure-tek

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Posted

I think the Bob at Pressure Tek (another Ohio Boy) should run a test, find out that it works great and double his sales of Accumulators overnignt...... then send me a free one for suggesting it.

crappiecrazed likes this

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Posted

This would be a good question for Bob at pressure-tek

 

 

I think the Bob at Pressure Tek (another Ohio Boy) should run a test, find out that it works great and double his sales of Accumulators overnignt...... then send me a free one for suggesting it.

 

I posted this thread over at Bob's Forum http://www.ptstate.com/index.php/topic,14318.0.html so hopefully he will see it, then come and chime in with his opinions.

al9226 likes this

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Posted

Chris,

I saw somewhere, and for the life of me I can't remember where, a guy using one of these. My concern would be if the diaphram would hold up to SH.

He claimed they worked and that's way I remember this product. Now if I could only remember where I saw it. Another sign of old age.

Hank     

 

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Posted

Chris,

I saw somewhere, and for the life of me I can't remember where, a guy using one of these. My concern would be if the diaphram would hold up to SH.

He claimed they worked and that's way I remember this product. Now if I could only remember where I saw it. Another sign of old age.

Hank     

 

Well, the Accumilators  I have seen have EDPM (rubber) bladders. EDPM is decent for SH resistance, but I would change these every year, just to be sure the bladder don't rupture.

 

Bronze or Stainless Steel will also work, for awhile. The Chlorine is nasty chit, and will attack Stainless and Bronze too.

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Posted

I don't think that would work being they work on 50 lbs of pressure. Two tanks would make 100 lbs, I think!

Art... You are right about the 50 lb setting, but I think you can adjust that by letting out some air on the valve on the back.  I just wonder how to hook them up.  In my mind I see a T at the pump going to each accumulator, then have them go to a T to the hose reel.  The other way would be directly inline.  I don't know if this would be like a battery (Series or Parallel) to get the desired results.  Anyone care to weigh in?

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Posted

Both the Delavan Fat Boy, and the Flo Jet Pentaflex are awesome roof cleaning pumps.

As long as you have a shingle roof with gutters, to catch the run off! 

On a Tile Roof, the output from the pump is so much, that run off is a serious problem.

Why is run off a serious problem?  It does not bother me.  I use AC's gutter canes in the gutters to dilute the solution with no problems.  If no gutter I use 4' x 8' coreoplast signs laid in the drip line for the solution to fall on and my ground man sprays them continuously with a pressure washer at low pressure.

Now, if you use a smaller nozzle with the Fat Boy or Pentaflex, the pump cycles on and off too much, and will burn itself up!

It does not burn the motor up it will cause the pressure valve switch to melt.  I have extra pressure valve switches in stock.  The ones for a Delavan are cheap, the ones for a Pentaflex are $60 ea.     

 

 

So, I got to thinking, the Fat Boy is a 12 volt pump, right ?

So, why not slow the god dam pump down, by simply using a  Rheostat to reduce the voltage it sees?

Now, we will need a 20 amp 12 volt Rheostat, and I have not tried this, so I don't know for sure it will work. 

In theory you could use a Rheostat but how are you going to adjust it when you are on the roof.   PIA...  I like having all the power my pentaflex will muster so I can shoot long distances if I need to.  I have never tried it so I do not know.

 

 

Here is something that may work even better then a Rheostat http://www.cloudelectric.com/product-p/co-kdz24200.htm

 

It is a 12 volt 150 amp capable adjustable power supply using Pulse Width Modulation. 

Pulse Width Modulation would probably be a better way to go as the voltage would remain constant at 12 volts and you would be throttling the motor back by allowing  the PWM unit to turn the power on and off at high speed.  Once again, how are you going to control it when you are on a roof?

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Posted

Marcus, my source for those coreplast signs went out of business!

One you have slowed the pump down enough to not cycle with the nozzle  u have chosen for the roof, then why do you need to control the pump anymore ?

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Posted

I posted this thread over at Bob's Forum http://www.ptstate.com/index.php/topic,14318.0.html so hopefully he will see it, then come and chime in with his opinions.

Just went over to the other forum.  I didn't see anything from Bob.  I may call him today.  Raining like crazy tday.  No cleaning for me.

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Posted

Just went over to the other forum.  I didn't see anything from Bob.  I may call him today.  Raining like crazy tday.  No cleaning for me.

WE have a HUGE Tile Roof Cleanig Job today down in Parish Florida, south of here abut 30 miles, all interstate.

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Posted

Don't know much about pumps, however for window cleaning we use "varistreams" to control the flow. I had one made up to control the Flo Jet Pentaflex pump I have for my new van ( if I ever get it set up, had to wait for it to be valued by Irish Revenue ( import) and now cant find anyone to fit roller doors on it, promised by a couple of people but they never got back to me so the van sits idle 6 weeks after buying it. Anyhow I will let you guys know how it works out when it is fitted. Here is a link to Gardiner pole systems  - to give you an idea of what I am talking about . 

 

http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/System___Pump_Controllers.html

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Posted

Don't know much about pumps, however for window cleaning we use "varistreams" to control the flow. I had one made up to control the Flo Jet Pentaflex pump I have for my new van ( if I ever get it set up, had to wait for it to be valued by Irish Revenue ( import) and now cant find anyone to fit roller doors on it, promised by a couple of people but they never got back to me so the van sits idle 6 weeks after buying it. Anyhow I will let you guys know how it works out when it is fitted. Here is a link to Gardiner pole systems  - to give you an idea of what I am talking about . 

 

http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/System___Pump_Controllers.html

This is exactly what we need! Do these work by slowing the motor down ?

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Posted

Yes Chris, depending on the type of controller you buy you can adjust the flow rate and also adjust the pressure. The standard window cleaning controllers probably would not be able for the fat boy or the pentaflex. I will contact the guy who made my controller and ask him if he can make one to control the flow and the pressure, i imagine that there wont be any problem in doing it. I also know another guy that would be able to do it as well.

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Posted

Yes Chris, depending on the type of controller you buy you can adjust the flow rate and also adjust the pressure. The standard window cleaning controllers probably would not be able for the fat boy or the pentaflex. I will contact the guy who made my controller and ask him if he can make one to control the flow and the pressure, i imagine that there wont be any problem in doing it. I also know another guy that would be able to do it as well.

Remember, we are pumping chlorine, not water!

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Posted

My Accumulator just went out on me.  I ordered a different one with larger capacity (gallons).  Should be here by Wednesday or Thursday.  We'll see if this changes anything.

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Posted

I understand that Chris but why would it make a difference since the chemicals are not interacting with the controller only the pump?

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