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EXTREMELY Dirty, Hyper Lichen Encrusted Metal Roofs...Help!

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I am in the process of bidding out the cleaning on a 68,000 Square ft storage complex with 25+ year old metal roofs. I have the advantage over the other guys in that the owner do NOT want any sort of pressure washing done on them...so it will be a chem only deal. Problem is...the roofs haven't been cleaned in 25+ years and they are absolutely CAKED with lichen on every possible surface. I stopped by and hit a test patch today with some 30% mix left from the job earlier in the day and while it did make a difference...not nearly the difference I would like. Even after a scrub down with a soft deck brush, there was still a layer of this cr@p on the metal. Told the owner that I would adjust the mix and be back for another test patch. 

 

I am thinking dwell time perhaps? Ammonyx Mo perhaps? Or some truck wash. I do plan to use Sodium Metasilicate in the rinse water to stop corrosion. I will have to rent a 500 Gal water trailer since there is one and only one water spigot. 

 

The guys are liking me because I am letting them know that it won't need to be repainted...which is true, there was no rust underneath once I got one small section scrubbed down...but I want this CLEAN since these guys are well connected and it could result in some nice commercial projects. 

 

Suggestions for chems/mix would be greatly appreciated. 

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I am in the process of bidding out the cleaning on a 68,000 Square ft storage complex with 25+ year old metal roofs. I have the advantage over the other guys in that the owner do NOT want any sort of pressure washing done on them...so it will be a chem only deal. Problem is...the roofs haven't been cleaned in 25+ years and they are absolutely CAKED with lichen on every possible surface. I stopped by and hit a test patch today with some 30% mix left from the job earlier in the day and while it did make a difference...not nearly the difference I would like. Even after a scrub down with a soft deck brush, there was still a layer of this cr@p on the metal. Told the owner that I would adjust the mix and be back for another test patch. 

 

I am thinking dwell time perhaps? Ammonyx Mo perhaps? Or some truck wash. I do plan to use Sodium Metasilicate in the rinse water to stop corrosion. I will have to rent a 500 Gal water trailer since there is one and only one water spigot. 

 

The guys are liking me because I am letting them know that it won't need to be repainted...which is true, there was no rust underneath once I got one small section scrubbed down...but I want this CLEAN since these guys are well connected and it could result in some nice commercial projects. 

 

Suggestions for chems/mix would be greatly appreciated. 

There are better things to kill Lichens then our roof cleaning mix!

Here is how the Brits do it http://www.roofclean.co.uk/

 

Or this 

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Hmmm...if they are using a Quat...I stock that in large quantities for my Mold Remediation company. I could try spraying a bit of Quat on there and see what happens. Good thing is....it is cheap. If I could get away with spraying a Quat with some surfactant instead of SH, then the materials cost just went WAY down!

As for the second video....those guys are roofers. Have to be since they obviously want to replace that roof soon. YIKES!

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ksroofs   

im with him^ try a stronger mix.. and the moss absorbs alot of mix.. spray it 2 times or until the moss is all white.. Let is sit as long as you need it to without drying out.. then use an extension brush or just try to rinse it after that.. I have never had too much problem when i bump up the mix and let it sit

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Hmmm. You know what....that second video got me thinking. While that pavement sweeper idea is abhorrent, particularly on asphalt shingle roofs....the idea of a drum style buffer got me thinking. What about a pneumatic aircraft drum buffer? It will take that crap layer off, polish and restore the finish. Perhaps metal roof polishing could be a thing?

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im with him^ try a stronger mix.. and the moss absorbs alot of mix.. spray it 2 times or until the moss is all white.. Let is sit as long as you need it to without drying out.. then use an extension brush or just try to rinse it after that.. I have never had too much problem when i bump up the mix and let it sit

Yeah....this isn't moss. It is a near solid layer of tiny lichen on a corrugated metal roof. I am in Washington state....trust me, I deal with a LOT of moss...just finished a mossy, lichen filled asphalt roof before this one. No...this is a solid layer of tiny lichen that is pretty well bonded to the surface.

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Yeah....this isn't moss. It is a near solid layer of tiny lichen on a corrugated metal roof. I am in Washington state....trust me, I deal with a LOT of moss...just finished a mossy, lichen filled asphalt roof before this one. No...this is a solid layer of tiny lichen that is pretty well bonded to the surface.

 

Hmmm...if they are using a Quat...I stock that in large quantities for my Mold Remediation company. I could try spraying a bit of Quat on there and see what happens. Good thing is....it is cheap. If I could get away with spraying a Quat with some surfactant instead of SH, then the materials cost just went WAY down!

As for the second video....those guys are roofers. Have to be since they obviously want to replace that roof soon. YIKES!

 

 

Try a stronger mix

 

 

im with him^ try a stronger mix.. and the moss absorbs alot of mix.. spray it 2 times or until the moss is all white.. Let is sit as long as you need it to without drying out.. then use an extension brush or just try to rinse it after that.. I have never had too much problem when i bump up the mix and let it sit

 

 

Hmmm. You know what....that second video got me thinking. While that pavement sweeper idea is abhorrent, particularly on asphalt shingle roofs....the idea of a drum style buffer got me thinking. What about a pneumatic aircraft drum buffer? It will take that crap layer off, polish and restore the finish. Perhaps metal roof polishing could be a thing?

 

Me thinks a Quat with a sticky surfactant would be a more potent "witches brew" to best kill the Moss/Lichens.

I also wonder if a floor polisher with some kind of soft wire brush wheel will work ?

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Do you mean Lichen something like this. Should be fine just let dwell longer.

 

http://youtu.be/je2KhP1DHpw

 

 

 

The Lichen is smaller and more evenly covers the surface. I've never seen a metal roof that looks like it before. I have some Ammonyx Mo on order from my local chem guy  and will try a test patch with some Mo, a  higher percentage SH mix and a mix of Mo and Quat. 

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The Lichen is smaller and more evenly covers the surface. I've never seen a metal roof that looks like it before. I have some Ammonyx Mo on order from my local chem guy  and will try a test patch with some Mo, a  higher percentage SH mix and a mix of Mo and Quat. 

Next time, order Myrastamine instead of Ammonyx, unless Ammonyx MO is Myrastamine, and not lauramine oxide.

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Ammonyx MO is Myristamine Oxide. Ammonyx LO is Lauramine Oxide. From Stephan.com, the manufacturers...

AMMONYX MO is an amphoteric surfactant used as a cleansing agent, foam stabilizer and viscosity builder in personal care and HI&I products.

Application

2 in 1 Shampoo, Adjuvants, Bar Soap, Body Wash, Facial Cleansers, Foam Boosters, Granular Baits (GB), Hand Dishwashing, Hard Surface Care, Industrial Cleaning, Laundry Commercial, Laundry Household, Liquid Hand Soap, Machine Dishwashing, Ready-To-Use (RTU), Shampoos, Soluble Concentrates (Sl), Sulfate-Free, Suspoemulsions (SE), Wettable Powders (WP)

Chemical Description

MYRISTYL DIMETHYLAMINE OXIDE

************

AMMONYX LO is an amphoteric surfactant finding application in personal care, HI&I applications as foam enhancers, viscosity builders and as emulsifiers and lubricants in textile applications. This product meets U.S. EPA Design for Environment (DfE) screen and is listed on www.cleangredients.org.

Application

2 in 1 Shampoo, Adjuvants, All Purpose Cleaning, Bar Soap, Body Wash, Delicate/Fine Fabric Wash, Detergents, Drilling Additives, Facial Cleansers, Foam Boosters, Foaming Additive, Granular Baits (GB), Hair Conditioners, Hard Surface Care, Industrial Cleaning, Light Duty Cleaning, Liquid Hand Soap, Ready-To-Use (RTU), Shampoos, Soluble Concentrates (Sl), Sulfate-Free, Suspension Concentrates (SC), Suspoemulsions (SE), Textile and Synthetic Fibers, Textile Wet Processing, Wettable Powders (WP)

Chemical Description

LAURAMINE OXIDE

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Ammonyx MO is Myristamine Oxide. Ammonyx LO is Lauramine Oxide. From Stephan.com, the manufacturers...

AMMONYX MO is an amphoteric surfactant used as a cleansing agent, foam stabilizer and viscosity builder in personal care and HI&I products.

Application

2 in 1 Shampoo, Adjuvants, Bar Soap, Body Wash, Facial Cleansers, Foam Boosters, Granular Baits (GB), Hand Dishwashing, Hard Surface Care, Industrial Cleaning, Laundry Commercial, Laundry Household, Liquid Hand Soap, Machine Dishwashing, Ready-To-Use (RTU), Shampoos, Soluble Concentrates (Sl), Sulfate-Free, Suspoemulsions (SE), Wettable Powders (WP)

Chemical Description

MYRISTYL DIMETHYLAMINE OXIDE

************

AMMONYX LO is an amphoteric surfactant finding application in personal care, HI&I applications as foam enhancers, viscosity builders and as emulsifiers and lubricants in textile applications. This product meets U.S. EPA Design for Environment (DfE) screen and is listed on www.cleangredients.org.

Application

2 in 1 Shampoo, Adjuvants, All Purpose Cleaning, Bar Soap, Body Wash, Delicate/Fine Fabric Wash, Detergents, Drilling Additives, Facial Cleansers, Foam Boosters, Foaming Additive, Granular Baits (GB), Hair Conditioners, Hard Surface Care, Industrial Cleaning, Light Duty Cleaning, Liquid Hand Soap, Ready-To-Use (RTU), Shampoos, Soluble Concentrates (Sl), Sulfate-Free, Suspension Concentrates (SC), Suspoemulsions (SE), Textile and Synthetic Fibers, Textile Wet Processing, Wettable Powders (WP)

Chemical Description

LAURAMINE OXIDE

Cool, because Myristamine is the best, much better then lauramine, much thicker, sticks better!

Good Job! 

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Okay....so I went back out after finishing the roof jobs for the day and did two more test patches.

Patch 1. 40% SH to water with Ammonyx MO. l gave it some dwell time. Touched it....a little, but it was still pretty hard. Had to scrub with a deck Brush and even then, looked like cr@p.

Patch 2. High Concentrated Quat Fungicide with Ammonyx MO. Not much better. Practically no difference. Worried about the runoff on this one since the Quat doesn't break down as easily.

Starting to get frustrated and the manager says he is skeptical...and I don't blame him. I am thinking this may need to be steam cleaned. Will keep pressure down while removing that layer of pretty much solid hardened Lichen/grime. Alternative is just to scrub the crap out of it....but labor costs are gonna suck. Need to find out if I can rent a steam cleaning machine. Might try some sodium Percarbonate for giggles to see what that does....though I doubt it will be any better.

I might also try an enzyme cleaner we use for mold remediation to break down organics.

This is definitely THE toughest roof job I have ever seen.

On a better note...I am loving me some Myristamine Oxide! Did a STEEP pitched roof today with a 1/3 12% SH 2/3 H2O mix with 7 cups of MO to 80 Gal and this got the moss way better than normal. It even stuck to the metal roof. 5 Gal for $40 is hard to argue with. Gonna try a mix with Gain and see how it does.

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Okay....so I went back out after finishing the roof jobs for the day and did two more test patches.

Patch 1. 40% SH to water with Ammonyx MO. l gave it some dwell time. Touched it....a little, but it was still pretty hard. Had to scrub with a deck Brush and even then, looked like cr@p.

Patch 2. High Concentrated Quat Fungicide with Ammonyx MO. Not much better. Practically no difference. Worried about the runoff on this one since the Quat doesn't break down as easily.

Starting to get frustrated and the manager says he is skeptical...and I don't blame him. I am thinking this may need to be steam cleaned. Will keep pressure down while removing that layer of pretty much solid hardened Lichen/grime. Alternative is just to scrub the crap out of it....but labor costs are gonna suck. Need to find out if I can rent a steam cleaning machine. Might try some sodium Percarbonate for giggles to see what that does....though I doubt it will be any better.

I might also try an enzyme cleaner we use for mold remediation to break down organics.

This is definitely THE toughest roof job I have ever seen.

On a better note...I am loving me some Myristamine Oxide! Did a STEEP pitched roof today with a 1/3 12% SH 2/3 H2O mix with 7 cups of MO to 80 Gal and this got the moss way better than normal. It even stuck to the metal roof. 5 Gal for $40 is hard to argue with. Gonna try a mix with Gain and see how it does.

Gain will not be as good as the Myristamine, as far as cling goes, and that is an awesome price you got on it! 

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Yeah....this isn't moss. It is a near solid layer of tiny lichen on a corrugated metal roof. I am in Washington state....trust me, I deal with a LOT of moss...just finished a mossy, lichen filled asphalt roof before this one. No...this is a solid layer of tiny lichen that is pretty well bonded to the surface.

Check this out, from our other roof cleaning forum http://roof-cleaning-institute.activeboard.com/t57287437/metal-roof-cleaning-removing-lichen/

I think sodium and/or potassium hydroxide will soften Lichens, but could be corrosive to the roof.

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Check this out, from our other roof cleaning forum http://roof-cleaning-institute.activeboard.com/t57287437/metal-roof-cleaning-removing-lichen/

I think sodium and/or potassium hydroxide will soften Lichens, but could be corrosive to the roof.

Yeah...I don't think I want to go there. I am going to go with a strong SH or SP...will try both/Ammonyx Mo mix followed by Dry Steam cleaning and then a water wash with some Sodium Metasilicate added to the final rinse for corrosion inhibition. P

. If we get the job that is. This is what several metal roof guys have said is the best way to solve this particular issue.

If we don't get it, I am not sure whether I will be disappointed or relieved.

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garyw   

this is the stuff Chris was talking about. I would not use it.

 

 

 
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Product Name: AlgoClear® Pro Softwash SDS Ref: TVS002 Version No: 1 Revision Date:   First Issue Date: December 17th 2008 1. IDENTIFICATION OF SUBSTANCE / PREPARATION AND OF THE COMPANY Product AlgoClear® Pro Softwash Use(s) Surface biocide and wood preservative for external surfaces Distributor Thames Valley Specialist Products
PO Box 1945 Telephone: +44 1628 687 022
Maidenhead SL6 2XR Emergency Telephone: SDS Competent Person e-mail: trevor@rising-hsand.co.uk 2. HAZARDS IDENTIFICATION Physical & Chemical: NON HAZARDOUS
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DANGEROUS FOR THE ENVIRONMENT Environmental: VERY TOXIC TO AQUATIC ORGANISMS 3. COMPOSITION / INFORMATION ON INGREDIENTS Hazardous Substances
Chemical name CAS-No EINECS/ELINCS Classification Concentration DIDECYLDIMETHYLAMMONIUM CHLORIDE 7173-51-5 230-525-2 Xn: R22
C: R34 Approx.40% 4. FIRST AID MEASURES General information Remove contaminated clothing immediately, to be disposed of or washed before re-use. Inhalation Remove casualty to fresh air and provide warmth and rest. If necessary seek medica l advice. Skin contact Clean areas of skin affected a once with soap and plenty of water; if necessary seek medical advice Eye contact Wash eyes thoroughly with plenty of water until irritation subsides. Consult an eye specialist/ophthalmologist. Ingestion If product is swallowed, do NOT induce vomiting. Drink plenty of water and if necessary seek medical advice. Beware of aspiration if vomiting occurs 5. FIRE FIGHTING MEASURES General hazard THE PRODUCT IS NOT FLAMMABLE Extinguishing media To suit local surroundings (e.g. water spray, foam, or chemical powder) Extinguishing media not to be used None known Special exposure hazards The thermal decomposition products released (oxides of nitrogen and carbon) should be considered toxic if inhaled. Protective equipment Wear self-contained breathing apparatus. Avoid run-off water entering the drains (e.g. use barriers) 6. ACCIDENTAL RELEASE MEASURES Methods for cleaning up Adhere to personal protective measures. Take up with absorbent material, e.g. sand, sawdust, into tightly closed plastic containers. Environmental considerations Do not allow liquid to get into waste water or waterways; if this occurs, inform the relevant water authority at once. Further information Spillage will cause a slippery floor. 7. HANDLING & STORAGE Advice on safe handling Handle in accordance with good hygiene and safety practice.. Keep in original containers which should be tightly closed, cool and dry. Storage conditions Ensure adequate ventilation of the storage area. Storage temperature should be 10 -40ºC. Further information Keep away from incompatible substances 8. EXPOSURE CONTROLS / PERSONAL PROTECTION Exposure controls There are no workplace exposure limit values available. Comply with good practice for the control of exposure. Engineering controls Ensure adequate ventilation of working area. Personal protection Observe normal standards for handling chemicals. Avoid contact with skin and eyes. Wash thoroughly after handling (shower if necessary). Do not eat, drink or smoke in the working area. Wear personal protective equipment appropriate to the task (see below) Eye protection Safety goggles (e.g. EN 166)
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EC50 Algae 0.026 mg/l 96 h (OECD 201) Degradability Readily degradable (72% - Sturm test) (didecyldimethylammonium chloride) Further information Since bats are a protected species under the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981, consult English Nature, The Scottish Natural Heritage or The Countryside Council for Wales if structure to be treated is used by bats. 13. DISPOSAL CONSIDERATIONS Advice on disposal In accordance with national and local authority regulations, e.g. The Hazardous Waste (England & Wales) Regulations 2005. Contaminated packaging Treat empty containers in the same way as the product or if possible wash out thoroughly and recycle. 14. TRANSPORT INFORMATION United Nations number UN 1760 Packaging group III
IMDG code 8/1760/III RID / ADR 8/III ICAO / IATA 8/1760/III Marine pollutant The product should not be marked as a marine pollutant Proper shipping name CORROSIVE LIQUID, N.O.S. (DIDECYLDIMETHYLAMMONIUM CHLORIDE) 15. REGULATORY INFORMATION Classification & labelling The product is classified in accordance with the Chemicals (Hazard Information and Packaging for Supply) Regulations (CHIP 3.2) and the Dangerous Preparations Directive (1999/45/EC)
Contains didecyldimethylammonium chloride
CORROSIVE Risk phrases R22 HARMFUL IF SWALLOWED
R34 CAUSES BURNS
R50 VERY TOXIC TO AQUATIC ORGANISMS.

Safety phrases S25 AVOID CONTACT WITH EYES.
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clean-roof-2.jpg
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AlgoClear® Pro Softwash has been developed by scientists to safely, quickly and effectively remove all types of moss, algae & lichen from a wide range of different surfaces but particularly produces dramatic results on roof surfaces.

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